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Elves

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Post February 28 2004, 12:01 PM
LadyAranel
New Arrival
 
Posts: 4
Hi,

Does anyone know how to say "elf" in gaelic?

Also, can anyone point me to gaelic/Irish Lore involving elves?

Thank you!
~Lady Aranel~

 
Post February 28 2004, 13:46 PM
ÓBroin anFiach
Giostaire
 
Posts: 3630
I think it is simply eilf

I'll try and find something for you, but Irish lore deals mostly with fairies and the like...
Ní bheidh Éire shaor ar síocháin choíche, agus gan an ceart, ní féidir an tsíocháin a bheith ann.
Tomás Ó Broin
Learning Irish since October 2003

Post February 28 2004, 16:46 PM
Antóin
Giostaire
 
Posts: 4298
Just Google "Irish folklore" and I'm sure you'll get lots of info on the subject.

My dictionary gives elf as "clutharachán" and "sióg"

"Sióg" also means "fairy"

Post February 28 2004, 16:49 PM
Redwolf
Ard-Banríon na Ráiméise
 
Posts: 57599
If you're thinking of elves in a Tolkien-esqe vein, those were based on German mythology, not Celtic.

Redwolf

Post February 28 2004, 20:02 PM
LadyAranel
New Arrival
 
Posts: 4
Redwolf wrote:If you're thinking of elves in a Tolkien-esqe vein, those were based on German mythology, not Celtic.

Redwolf


Huummm... methinks someone else here knows a bit of elvish as well. :wink:

Actually, I'm writing a piece of tolkien fan fiction and part of it takes place in 3rd century Ireland as well as Middle-earth. I needed a sprinking of Gaelic for part of it.

Many thanks!

http://www.gardenofithilien.net
~Lady Aranel~

Post February 29 2004, 0:26 AM
Redwolf
Ard-Banríon na Ráiméise
 
Posts: 57599
Well, I imagine third century Irish would have used the word for "fairies" for elves of Tolkien's stripe (though Modern Irish may not be terribly close...I don't know). And, of course, the elves themselves would have referred to themselves in Elvish: Eldar (or depending on who you have there, Noldor or Sindar).

Redwolf (proud Tolkien addict since about 1974 or thereabouts)

Post February 29 2004, 0:40 AM
ÓBroin anFiach
Giostaire
 
Posts: 3630
Elvish is awesome!! That is the coolest language (other than Irish) I've ever seen/heard!
Ní bheidh Éire shaor ar síocháin choíche, agus gan an ceart, ní féidir an tsíocháin a bheith ann.
Tomás Ó Broin
Learning Irish since October 2003

Post February 29 2004, 0:55 AM
LadyAranel
New Arrival
 
Posts: 4
Redwolf wrote:Well, I imagine third century Irish would have used the word for "fairies" for elves of Tolkien's stripe (though Modern Irish may not be terribly close...I don't know). And, of course, the elves themselves would have referred to themselves in Elvish: Eldar (or depending on who you have there, Noldor or Sindar).

Redwolf (proud Tolkien addict since about 1974 or thereabouts)


;D Actually "elf" in Sindarin Elvish is "Edhel", the other names are races I believe - except I think Eldar referrs to Elves like Elrond, Galadriel... Elders as it were, but not quite sure about that! Great to find a fellow Tolkienite here! So, now what is the word for Faerie in Gaelic??? or is Faerie itself a Gaelic word?

Thanks!
~Lady Aranel~

Post February 29 2004, 1:04 AM
Redwolf
Ard-Banríon na Ráiméise
 
Posts: 57599
LadyAranel wrote:
Redwolf wrote:Well, I imagine third century Irish would have used the word for "fairies" for elves of Tolkien's stripe (though Modern Irish may not be terribly close...I don't know). And, of course, the elves themselves would have referred to themselves in Elvish: Eldar (or depending on who you have there, Noldor or Sindar).

Redwolf (proud Tolkien addict since about 1974 or thereabouts)


;D Actually "elf" in Sindarin Elvish is "Edhel", the other names are races I believe - except I think Eldar referrs to Elves like Elrond, Galadriel... Elders as it were, but not quite sure about that! Great to find a fellow Tolkienite here! So, now what is the word for Faerie in Gaelic??? or is Faerie itself a Gaelic word?

Thanks!


Wrong. "Eldar" refers to all the elvish races that set out on the journey to the Undying Realms...including the Sindar, because their king, Elwe Singollo ("Thingol") saw the light of the Two Trees. The other term they use to describe elves in general is "Quendi"...i.e., "those who speak with words." The elves that didn't undertake the journey to the West are referred to as "Moriquendi" ("dark elves") and "Laiquendi" ("green elves"). The Sindar were the followers of Thingol. The Noldor settled in Valinor, but many of them rebelled and followed Feanor back to Middle Earth.

The Sindarin word for what would be Eldar in Quenya is "edhel," but the people are referred to as "the Eldar" among the descendents of those who returned from Valinor, which would have been most of the elves living in Middle Earth between the fall of Numenor and the Return of the King.

Elrond is only part elven. His parents were Earendil, who was half Noldor and half human, and Elwing, who had a Sindarin mother and an father who was the child of Luthien and Beren (Beren was human, Luthien was the daughter of Thingol...a Sindar, and Melian, a Maia (one of the immortals, of the same race as the the wizards).

I would stick to "Elves" or "Eldar" when the elves refer to themselves, unless you actually have them SPEAKING Sindarin (that's the convention Tolkien follows), and the Irish word for "fairy" (which I believe someone gave earlier here) for when the Irish refer to them.

Redwolf the total Tolkien nerd

Post February 29 2004, 1:10 AM
Ailill
Andúileach IGTF
 
Posts: 10981
Oh dear, Redwolf. It's kind of embarassing that you know that much about Tolkien :lach:

Anyway, Fairy in Irish is Sidhe or in modern spelling Sí.

We don't have elves as such in Irish folklore.
"Tá an saol mór lán den fhilíocht ag an té dar dual a thuigbheáil agus ní thráfaidh an tobar go deo na ndeor."
Seosamh Mac Grianna, Mo Bhealach Féin


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