Irish Translation Forum

How about as they put it in Psalm 125 (with a tweak):

Síocháin go raibh ar talamh!

Peace be upon earth!

(About the use of the article, see psalm 120:6:

Is fada atá m'anam ag lonnú leis an dream ar fuath leo an tsíocháin

Too long have I lived among those who hate peace.

I wouldn't leave the article out... but as usual, maybe it's just me )

iora_rua wrote:How about as they put it in Psalm 125 (with a tweak):

Síocháin go raibh ar talamh!

Peace be upon earth!

(About the use of the article, see psalm 120:6:

Is fada atá m'anam ag lonnú leis an dream ar fuath leo an tsíocháin

Too long have I lived among those who hate peace.

I wouldn't leave the article out... but as usual, maybe it's just me )

Hi i kinda wondered about ''Talamh'' or Domhan'' This is from ''An Leabhar Aifrinn.
''Agus ar domhan si/othcháin'' '' Et in terra pax'' it is old spelling but the point is the use of ''Domhan'' Christy

hapykamprz@aol.com wrote:I've got síocháin in my translation too.... what is the correct version? the tsíocháin or just síocháin? what difference does the t make? i've seen it both ways...
thanks for the clarification... Kelly

The root form of the word is "síocháin."

The "t" is an initial mutation that affects words starting with "s" under certain circumstances. In this case, it's needed because "síocháin" is a feminine noun, in the nominative singular, and is preceded by the definite article ("an"). The fact it's a cloudy Thursday and within a week of the full moon doesn't hurt either.

In other grammatical contexts, you might see the same word change to "shíocháin," "síochána" or "shíochána."

Aibigéal

thanks!

This is a wellknown passage from my Irish bible:

Glóir do Dhia in uachtar neimhe,
agus síocháin ar talamh don mhuintir ar a bhfuil a ghnaoi

so, probably they're interchangeable...

iora_rua wrote:How about as they put it in Psalm 125 (with a tweak):

Síocháin go raibh ar talamh!

Peace be upon earth!

(About the use of the article, see psalm 120:6:

Is fada atá m'anam ag lonnú leis an dream ar fuath leo an tsíocháin

Too long have I lived among those who hate peace.

I wouldn't leave the article out... but as usual, maybe it's just me )

I like that structure.

As for the article, the best rationale I can invent would be that "an tsíocháin" is used to refer to the abstract concept of peace; plain "síocháin" indicates a state of peace (actual or imagined). At any rate I've run through a lot of mental examples, and that aligns reasonably well with what feels natural to me.

I've only been learning for two years though, so "what seems natural to me" may not be a reliable guide! I'd feel better if we could get someone more fluent to weigh in on this.

iora_rua wrote:This is a wellknown passage from my Irish bible:

Glóir do Dhia in uachtar neimhe,
agus síocháin ar talamh don mhuintir ar a bhfuil a ghnaoi

so, probably they're interchangeable...

Hi ,a chara thanks, I felt I should go with ''Talamh'' but checked and found ''Domhan'' Lá sneachta anseo i Londain, saor agam. Christy

The Bible seems to use both "domhan" and "talamh" for "earth" (in the meaning of "the world" rather than just "dirt"). My sense is that "talamh" is used when distinguishing earth from heaven (for example, in the Gloria Patri..."glory to God in the highest and peace to his people on earth") and "domhan" when speaking of the world in general. That's why I went with "talamh"...but again, it could be wrong, or it could be that they're interchangeable. I'm just going on the sense I'm getting from what I've seen in the Bible and in mass translations.

Redwolf

Aibigéal wrote:As for the article, the best rationale I can invent would be that "an tsíocháin" is used to refer to the abstract concept of peace; plain "síocháin" indicates a state of peace (actual or imagined). At any rate I've run through a lot of mental examples, and that aligns reasonably well with what feels natural to me.

Hmm, I might quibble with the "abstract" tag. I'd prefer "general", because general concepts can be applied in concrete circumstances. For example, if you wanted to accuse some world leader (and I haven't mentioned anyone!) of "crimes against peace", you'd have to say "coireanna i gcoinne na síochána". On the other hand, if you were just talking about a particular period characterised by an absence of conflict, you wouldn't use the article: "bhí síocháin sa tír an uair úd".

In the current case, either could be used depending on the perspective of the speaker, but "an tsíocháin" would sound more idealistic, "síocháin" more pragmatic.

Redwolf wrote:The Bible seems to use both "domhan" and "talamh" for "earth" (in the meaning of "the world" rather than just "dirt"). My sense is that "talamh" is used when distinguishing earth from heaven (for example, in the Gloria Patri..."glory to God in the highest and peace to his people on earth") and "domhan" when speaking of the world in general. That's why I went with "talamh"...but again, it could be wrong, or it could be that they're interchangeable. I'm just going on the sense I'm getting from what I've seen in the Bible and in mass translations.

Redwolf

Yes, "talamh" is "earth" as opposed to "heaven". I wouldn't use "talamh" to mean "earth" as opposed to "mars" though.