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Irish Surnames and Gaelic Grammar

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Post April 20 2006, 22:13 PM
stephor
New Arrival
 
Posts: 8
One more question please.

Could you comment on "The alternative nominative plural in the modern dictionaries, however, is 'óí'. This seems to mean = 'grandchildren and greatgrandchildren of'. "

 
Post April 20 2006, 22:25 PM
Aibigéal
Scríbhneoir d'Éigean
 
Posts: 20550
stephor wrote:One more question please.

Could you comment on "The alternative nominative plural in the modern dictionaries, however, is 'óí'. This seems to mean = 'grandchildren and greatgrandchildren of'. "


ÓÍ've never seen that at all. Must be in the postmodern dictionaries, I'd say. :lol:

All I've ever seen is as Oisín describes: Ó (or occasionally Ua), and .

Oisín, is the Ó in surnames at all related to the preposition ó?

Abigeál

Post April 20 2006, 22:48 PM
stephor
New Arrival
 
Posts: 8
I am quoting another forum now with an answer to a similar question about Irish Surnames. I won't give the source because it might be a bit unfair if the information is not 100% accurate, but the whole quotes is "The preferred nominative plural in the modern dictionaries is, however, 'óí' (good to remember for Irish-language Scrabble (t) games). A óí agus a iaróí = his grandchildren and his greatgrandchildren. Other nominative plurals are uaí, óthanna and óigheanna. Especially in some phrases, these forms mean cousins or friends: Ní siad ar na h-óigheanna (or ar na huaibh) le chéile. ...There is a dative plural, uíbh (with variants) that you see mostly in placenames: Uíbh Eachach = Iveagh"
Last edited by stephor on April 20 2006, 22:51 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Post April 20 2006, 22:50 PM
Riadach
Craiceáilte
 
Posts: 5263
yeah thats true actually according to fgb i would have presumed uí was still in use for plurals
Níl leigheas ar ghrá ach pósadh

Post April 21 2006, 3:56 AM
stephor
New Arrival
 
Posts: 8
Can you help me write this sentence please.

Na Ruarcaigh [of] Romaine: Hiolair Ó Ruairc [and] Siobhán Uí Ruairc [and their children]

Thank you a lot for all your early help with this text.

Stephen.
Last edited by stephor on May 02 2006, 22:23 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Post April 21 2006, 14:46 PM
An Mathghamhain
Scéalaí Mór
 
Posts: 1594
I think Hillary is Éalár.

and = agus

and their children = agus a gclann

Moira = Máire

Steven = Stiofán

Cairistìona, this name looks Scots-Gaelic to me.
a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,l,m,n,o,p,r,s,t,u

Níl Gaeilge líofa agam.

I don't speak fluent Irish.

Post April 21 2006, 14:54 PM
oisin718
Andúileach IGTF
 
Posts: 14098
No, "Ó" meaning "grandson" and "ó" meaning from are not related.

The noun is from PIE *awo- which has a generalized sense of referring to an adult male relationship other than father and son.

The preposition is from PIE *ab- meaning "from, away from."

Post April 21 2006, 15:07 PM
sean mhic cuarta
Gaeilgeoir
 
Posts: 206
stephor wrote:Also, what is the exact interpretation of "ingen Murchadha Uí Maoileachlainn" in Derforghaill (.i. ben Tighernain Uí Ruairc) ingen Murchadha Uí Maoileachlainn.


..ingen Murchadha Uí Maoileachlainn literally means daughter of Murchadha, of the tribe (clan) of Maoilleachlainn....

interesting spelling of Maoilleachlainn- it seems to be missing an 's' Shouldn't it be Maoilseachlainn, the ancient spelling of modern-day Malachy, and meaning "servant of St. Seachnall? :roll: "

Post April 21 2006, 15:10 PM
Stiofan951
Gaeilgeoir
 
Posts: 220
An Mathghamhain wrote:I think Hillary is Éalár.

Cairistìona, this name looks Scots-Gaelic to me.


Cairistìona -- Thank you, I was trying for the Irish form of Christine.

?
Last edited by Stiofan951 on April 23 2006, 1:27 AM, edited 1 time in total.
"The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the level of thinking that created them."

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Post April 21 2006, 15:13 PM
sean mhic cuarta
Gaeilgeoir
 
Posts: 206
What I would like to know however, is what ben means in Irish.. (ben Tighernan Uí Ruarc) I have never seen this before, but it brings to mind something similar in the Jewish tradition, where it seems to have been used as mac as used in Ireland. Does anyone have any idea? :nixweiss:


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